Yeah...my first shot at a melee map. 2 players. Enjoy. Or, tell me what sucks about it so that I can make it better. That would help too.

The picture kinda sucks, but the ramps are blocked off by 2 (32)min blocks. SO don't ask. If you've got a better utility to take images of the map, lemme know. I'm not the best handling terrain, because this is my first attempt. Ever. So, tell me what's wrong, I'll do my best to fix it.

And I don't know why it is called "Arena" because I named it "(2)Arenaria(n).scx" Why did it cut off the name? It has a completely different meaning, this way. Whatever. Enjoy.
modified by Corvett

first of all "D

the mains are equal in size.. make sure u at least get them close in size

the inverted ramp can be done so much better. Search for (0)Desert Ramp in our Database .. u can copy and paste the ramps from there into ur map

the distances are too long.

There expos are placed too closely together (big no no)

u seperated the map into 2 battlefields, but the center is too tight.. it allows T to really grab lots of expos (tho i believe its not possible to hold an opponent like that, ppl will complain so open up the center)

along with mirroring the mains correctly, make sure that the mineral lines are placed nicely and efficiently by the start locations or possible cc/hatchery/nexus areas.

Check the MOTWs for future references for examples to mold ur maps around (meaning basic/standard and balanced ideas)

DONT YOU EVER INSULT THE DIGNITY AND DIVINITY OF THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE ARENA.

the original Arena also sucks and is imbalanced.

dont do drugs.

Change name please.
modified by LGI

Read the comment that I first posted. I did NOT name the thing "Arena" and I don't know how to change that. If you tell me, I can. The only criticism that seems to be helping was NastyMarine's. Working on that.

just edit the map, and upload it with the new name.. thread name will also change

and you need editing, because you just put the mineral lines randomly (not the same amount of blocks, some uunavailable blocks)

the minonly expansion is very badly placed, work on a suitable space for unit travel, because now the main path leads through your economy.. that sux

Ok, I widened the central 'choke point' into, well, not much a choke point anymore. Fixed some expos, moved some stuff around, and attempted to fix base size. So how is it?

Don't count on the Obs map to be updated yet, because it isn't. I will probably update it with the final version of this.
modified by Corvett

you misunderstood me, i didnt mean to remove the expansions just place them properly :)

play against a computer with more than 20 workers in your mainbase (esp. red). what do you see?

Actually, all of them are minable :P Only one block at red's main is only mineable from behind, so one half of your workers will have a party behind the minerals.

All right, working on the mineability factor and mineral placements now. Thanks for pointing that out. Anything else look bad, need improvement, or anything? I suppose the minonly on each side would be easier to defend with the newly arranged centre. I'll put those back in.And work on the terrain's symmetry.

EDIT: Map reposted. Check it out. Criticize it. Thank you.
modified by Corvett

umm make the formations the same for the mains/min onlies/other expos. Difference can only mean an imbalance. A specific example, the main with a split formation will not recieve as much wandering effects of their workers, and will thusly need fewer miners whereas the other main will face quite a bit of wandering and will need more miners to obtain the same effects.

try decorating the map, doodads and terrain differences.

The "nat" if it can be called that is very open, it is nice to have your first expo atleast fairly easy to defend. Also it is far away, and there is plenty of space to put a real nat. The cross/swazticas create different sized chokes against the cliff there, they should be the same or pretty close.

The southern expo has a lot more room than the northern one.

You have to build in the back of your base which is awkward and can create bad pathfinding depending on building placement, you could put the formations in the back of the base to fix this, and they could still be really easy to harass depending on their position.

Check your distances from main to expo to expo.
Specifically, red is significantly closer to his mineral only nat thing.

umm the minerals on red's ramp don't appear in my scmdraft, and on the pic they are there, and you can't walk past them, but blue's ramp you can move a siege tank through

Imo you should stick to "traditional" mineral placement as you can see on lt, luna, or any of the MOTWs.
Some reasons:
- Map feels more comfortable (people are used to these)
- you're quite new to mapmaking; the traditional mineral formations are easy to do and always a safe shot, you should stick to those until you are more experienced

Especially the middle 5min-1gas-expansions have very bad mineral placement. It's uncomfortable, and does not even cause less wandering. Unless this really was your intention, you should avoid such placement.

Ok, I am coming back to this, and going to try to make it work much better. The mineral 'gates' on the ramps should be fixed... and I'm about to repost with the new min-gas configuration that spinesheath pointed out.

RE: Changed from 5-1 to 8-1. Picture updated. Help me out, here.
modified by Corvett

RE: Redid much of the map. Try it out. It looks a lot better(imo); got rid of some of the more useless stuff and replaced it with more useful other stuff. Look at the pic.
modified by Corvett

could you convert the map from bmp to jpg plz? :)

Converted to JPEG. Thanks.

How can I a)Remove the faulty Obs?
or b)Create a working Obs?
modified by Corvett

Article

For stuff like that, always check out the articles section at first.

yeah i also recommend to read the articles first :)

Ok, thanks. Wasn't aware that there was an article for that.

The map looks a bit barren and could use some decorational doodads. The gas nat is a bit away ("as the crow walks") from the main, won't zerg have some problems here? You could make the exit ramp feed directly into the gas nat and put a mineral only in the corner.

I did some decoration before seeing your comment, there, Lancet. That sounds like a great idea. I was looking at an older vers that I made with the nat in the corner, but it didn't look good at all. I'll see what I can do.

Re: Ok, I changed it. I personally like it better this way. Great suggestion. I took out the min gates, though. And the tar in the corners is pretty boring. Other than that, its good for now.
modified by Corvett

hmm it looks better than before, but the mains could use more room, and much of the map is still undecorated (big areas of just one terrain).

See how it looks now... I expanded the mains a bit into the tar, and moved the start locations to a more borderly spot. Some minor doodad placement, and some terrain changes on the main platforms. As my first time to decorate a map, I don't really know where I need more decor, and how. Please help me if I totally screw this up. Thanks.

looks better, but you could use different terrain so that it looks better :)
also all cliffs could look more natural
and the mineral placement is a bit awkward

The minerals in the NW main should face the valley (east) like the other main. I wanted to give you some decor site ideas but your picture doesn't fit the gmcs. Did you resize it to 768 x 768 pixels before posting? You can use a program called photofiltre that you can download free from the web. Also your map description merely says: "Arenaria by Corvett". Write one or two sentences to give us an idea of why Arenaria or what has happened, is happening or will happen at Arenaria.
modified by Lancet

I reposted with correct map size and min placement; I see what you mean with the cliff (esp at blue's main).

The map's very name is 'sand,' so I'm hoping to keep it more tannish than reddish in the end. I experimented a little with the crags a while back, and it just looked nasty. We'll see what happens.

RE: I tried to make the cliffs better, balance out the sizes of the nats, and used some diff terrain 'splotching' to create a better sense of different areas in the map (expos vs path, etc). If that doesn't make sense, just look.
modified by Corvett

OK, better but there may be a problem a problem. In the NW main units produced in structures to the SW of the nexus/command center may try to exit the main by the space between the minerals and the geyser and will be slowed down running through the workers. That space is greater in the NW main than in the SE main. Play some games against a friend or the comp to see if this is an issue. If it is, maybe you can place both mineral lines towards the back of the mains as to elliminate this problem. See gmcs for some decor(rocks, bushes, skeletons, wreckage etc) sites. You can place doodads almost anywhere they don't interfere with troop movements or building of structures.
modified by Lancet

I played it in NW, and didn't have much a problem there. I noticed a major problem with the N expo. Should I fix or remove?

fix

Alright, 'tis fixed. I wasn't sure how the arrows on the GMCS were pointing, but I tried to put something there. Tell me if I need to be more effective with a different approach or not.

RE: I was thinking of changing the expos on the N/S to a high dirt or a low pit area. It would take out the annoying-to-work-with compound that doesn't look to good anyway. Is this a good idea?
see what I mean...
modified by Corvett

Actually, your idea makes the map look much better I would say go ahead! As to my decor suggestions, I did not mean those arrows to represent single points but rather wider "areas" where you could place decorational doodads. Your map seems pretty much done. I am still not convinced about there not being any problems with the placement of minerals in the NW main. Perhaps you may want to upload some replays to demonstrate otherwise. If you can only play against the comp you may want to play against the Raynor-2 AI (artificial intelligence) which puts up more of a fight than the original Starcraft AI. You can dowload it at "http://www.entropyzero.org/BroodwarAI.html"

modified by Lancet

When I play NW (as all the testing is, by chance), I always seem to get enough out of the top space, but I have been dropped in on from the bottom. I can't seem to upload any reps for some reason. What do I do with the AI file?

RE: Red Start Loc moved to back of base, main min moved to opposite of valley for both red and blue. When I'm done with this, I don't know what I'll do next. I don't remember how to start a map.
modified by Corvett

I can't remember whether the AI file is downloaded as a RAR file in which case you will need to use the winzip or winrar programs to open it (I use winrar). Make sure your rep files end in ".rep". Your map looks much better now. If you want to create maps that are symetrical you can download the mirror tool at:

http://www.staredit.net/index.php?showtopic=37977

but be careful when you use it as it has a few bugs. I just use it to create the terrain and all the doodads, minerals, starting locations and spells I place with scmdraft2.

The map isnt all that bad but it needs some pimp-age. It doesnt really stand out at all.

Well, it is nothing out of the ordinary but it is his first melee map. Perhaps you may want to define for him (and for me for that matter) what pimp-age means, thanks.

I'm not sure I get what you mean by 'pimp-age' if I haven't done it over the past few months (compare to original). I think I need a break from this map, but how do I go about starting a new one? Hmm... with sketches, I guess...
modified by Corvett

Quite a lot of minerals here.
Also, Terran can land a Command Centre on the "island" expoes without having to drop a worker (making it imbalanced towards Terran).
The decoration is also very repetitive.
Much better than the original, though.

Added some Graphical comments.
modified by Pr0nogo

Pr0nogo dont bump maps that are so old unless you are sure that the author still exists.
How do you know its old?
Well look at the maps id, in the top left of the map next to the maps name. It says mapID 1572, and so you can compare your map id, tis in the 4011, see how old this one is?

It was in the "recent updates" area, and the last update was from the creator. Please pay attention.

no, there is a "random map" first, that can show a very old one.

Hey! I still exist. I just haven't had time to play for, well, years...

lol OMG ur OLD!!
:D
Welcome back !