Interesting layout, diffucult but not impossible to stop 2x expo.

tight

Nice. The "backyards" might be a little mor open though.

WOW, to be honest, this map out of all of mine plays the best. Played spectacular PvP on it which I thought I had pp on when I played it so I didn't save it thinkg autoreplay would save it but I wasn't on pp >,< But to me a good map is something with flar, good looks (doodads), playabilty, something a bit new, & most of portant path options. This map delivers them all. Most of the battles took place on the high roads on the side & some the temple got in the way so ima get rid of most of it.

double path thing again... gaema style mineral only is z>p rediculously in this map...
looks hard zvt, worse than rh3 for sunk placement...

mineral formations getting better, I like the middle and the E/W path system.

The part of the nat formation that sticks out is tvz helping for no reason...

The double path thing, I can see many games like that one in revlt recently where they went to eachothers' nats without realizing they passed eachother.

boring decoration in many parts, green blobs -_-

^ you do better? can do much around temple ;/

Idk if this was tested, but i thin blue's gas can get tanked..

The PvP I uploaded wasn't that good one that I played earlier.
It's really hard to test custom maps cuz everyone is like eww custom map, it must suck T_T

tk I can decorate 34095830495 times better than you

1) Nightmarjoo, doesn't sound too much like you were commenting on the map, but rather based on the author...

2) this is not gaema style - gaema involves being able to pass the natural's defense unharmed. And how should this setup help z in any way in zvp? Z would have to defend 2 expansions, it's less safe than on arena, lt, and the kind of map.

3) tvz always is hard if there is a cliff on top of the natural that you can reach without dropping. Needs testing, though, since the distances are quite far. I expect a lot of FEing on this map.

4) it's not double path, but rather triple path. If the map is executed correctly, the first scout would usually go from the top main to the right, then diagonally through the middle and to the bottom main from the left. If it does not, you should work on it so that it is that way.

5) What's wrong with players attacking each other on different routes? It's what makes games less macroish. If the only option is to walk head-on into the opponents army, it's pretty lame.

the main is so vulnerable to tanks, they could shoot the half of it and the biggest problem, they can reach the gas

spines: imo the path go in the right side, i see less chance for the left, but no-chance for that it goes through the center and yeah that is not give fair possibilites when attacking each other in early game

also the paths are very long, so it isnt rush friendly and could be little more open at the nat

I like spines fifth comment, cuz that what I was really going for, & btw joel I keep my maps looking natural with doodads not have 1 doodad right next to each other every square inch of the map, it hurts my eyes =(

Oh & yeah scouts go the path you said, if your at top main & send probe to bottom it goes out the right path across the center down the left pass & into main
modified by tktkvroom

Aight Nazgul has been finalized. I changed the ONLY problem that I had in game was the high jungle areas at 2 & 8 that had 4 temple walls there, I fought alot of big battles there in my PvP & didn't have much room micro & stuff. So I got rid of that temple & kept it nice & simple so there is more room
& of coarse the doodads dont show up ^^ dont you love it T_T
modified by tktkvroom

about decoration, I'm not talking about doodads. I'm not sure why everyone thinks doodads when I say decoration; I always indicate doodad deco seperate from decoration with terrain; I'm saying there isn't much variety, it's either solid block of this, or of that; you've been here long enough and mapping long enough that you can decorate better than this -.-

@spines I fail to see how this mineral only is different from Gaema

On Gaema, if you take your natural, you can use the path where the minonly is to go around the natural, maybe attack it from above, or try to directly attack the main, evading the natural's defenses.
All you can do here is attack it from above, which is a lack of a major element of Gaema.

Also, such nonlinear setup generally hurts z more than p, because z can't hide behind a single line of defense, but has to defend both nat and minonly.

you can do the same thing here oO
and zvp gaema was pretty easy since you could take your mineral only on 4hatch or 3hatch if you wanted safely and if protoss tried that you had 2 ramps to run up to attack/harass/delay/stop it; looks like same situation here, only distances are much longer in this map than in Gaema if I'm not mistaken.

It's not the same here... the nats defense covers the main choke, the minonly terrain does not lead you around that defense.

GMCS spines

It's "defense", not "distance", and you don't seem to properly read my posts...

Avoid the nat's defense to enter the MAIN, not the minonly... On Gaema, that is.

I'm 100% clear on what spines is saying lol

I fail to see how it matters, you can hit the mineral only without worrying about nat defense and attack the nat from it, and defending it won't be hard for zerg at all, and could be for p since there's two ramps.

How would it be easier to defend for z than for p?

lings > zlots, especially before zlot speed; one sunk in a zerg expo for basic defense/delay cost very little and will last long enough, but it takes several cannons to be effective against zerg =/
If p's army is defending the nat both ramps are undefended, if they defend one ramp you have the other ramp to go up =/ zerg's mobility would prevent this from being a problem for them.

It's rather uncommon for a protoss to take his nat before he has anything of the quality of zealot speed, and if he expands that fast, he will use many cannons anyways (especially because of muts)...

Also, once toss has speed and maybe +1 attacks, and an army that he would actually attack with, zerg needs quite a lot of defense. Several sunks, ideally some lurks, and lings of course.
Also remember that zergs like to have a linear expansion layout against protoss (not terran of course), this is because they don't need to defend 2 expansions. On this map they have to.

so with all this talk are you guys saying this is bad or good map, cuz thats all I really wanna know :D

lol most zerg nowadays get +1 armour before p gets +1 atk, and lings are still stronger than speedlots. Not to mention hydras on mineral only cliff with lings at ramp(s) > mining probes.

tk map is ok :)

Actually I see the exact opposite; many p going fe and thus having a forge anyways. p attack upgrade is faster than z armor as well.
I also see many toss going for either sair or +1 speedzeal/arch to be able to strike an early second expansion.
modified by spinesheath

aight, thats all i wanted to know :D